Clubhouse, Amazon, and the Future of Social Media

About This Episode

Join Luis in teaching Val what exactly he’s missing out on being an Android user without Clubhouse. Get ready to learn about the future of social media as well as what’s going on with Amazon in this week’s episode of The Brew.

Listen To The Episode On Spotify


[00:06:25] All right, welcome to The Brew. I’m your host Valtteri Salomake. Today I’m joined with Luis and we’ll see where this conversation will be going through today. But we’re going be talking about two topics. One will be clubhouse and the future of social media tied into that. And the other thing we’ll be talking about is going to be Amazon, as there’s a lot of conversations going about Amazon as well. And if you don’t know everything that’s going on in Atlanta, Georgia, definitely check that out, because it’s going to change a lot of things when it comes to labor laws and labor unions and all these things we talked about in the past. But getting into it, we’re going to be talking about clubhouse.

[00:06:59] And I’m just going to have to start by saying that I do have an android and I’m just going to get that out there. So Lewis doesn’t have as much ammunition against me as we discussed. Yeah, you’re putting it out there. So you’re giving me less leverage to really you know, I’m in a rap battle about trying to pull that off. Right. So you can’t. You can’t. I’m going to do this myself all the way through. So you just don’t have any ammunition. But a clubhouse came out.

[00:07:23] It took the world by storm. It went viral really, really quickly.

[00:07:27] And now so many people are using it. And I think for those that don’t know what clubhouse is, is it’s taking the idea of social media and actually making it social media, meaning it’s it’s taking the aspect of us having conversations in the social network and actually being able to have these conversations with people you might never be able to talk with. For example, like Elon Musk is on there. You have Tony Hawk on there. You have very high profile individuals in the real world. You probably never get a chance to talk with, but you can join a room. Right, and listen to them talk, ask like ask some questions from them. But I’m curious to have your impressions about clubhouse first before I talk about my perception of it, because, of course, you actually have an I device so you can use it.

[00:08:09] Yeah, I do. I have what is what is I think the superior, not necessarily mobile OS, but just like a mobile whole thing, because it’s all interconnected. That’s one that’s neither here nor there. I can I can back on you when we have an android for until the cows come home.

[00:08:25] Yeah. I mean, so here’s the thing. I think I see both sides of clubhouse. I think it’s really cool for what you brought up. The fact that I can be in a room with, like you said, like Elon Musk or even like when Mark Zuckerberg recently was on there, which I mean, shout out to the Zuck, I guess. But like, you know, he was on there along with a few other CEOs of really high profile tech companies. You know, that’s cool. You can be on there. You can just hear them talk. The fact that if you can if you can get into rooms that are small enough or if you can just like have the courage, I guess, to just like keep like asking to be a speaker. And then eventually you can ask some stuff. The fact that you can get your question answered directly from someone who maybe is an expert in that. I think that’s really cool. I think that just having a conversation with somebody is pretty neat. I mean, that’s kind of what we’re doing here. But the only difference, I guess, is we’re there’s like no real crowd. Like the crowd is on Twitch, which can, you know, they can come and stuff like that, but they can’t just, like, actually come to be a part of this conversation that we’re having. Yeah. So I think that’s like the biggest draw to clubhouse is that kind of thing. The other side that’s happening, though, is like and it’s happening now that more and more people are starting to get invited to a clubhouse, which is funny, like the idea of like this, like weird when it was like super exclusive when like we’re talking like maybe like half a million users were on it. That’s what I think that was a golden clubhouse when it was just like nothing but people helping people out because everyone so knew they didn’t. No one was really an influencer. No one really had a following yet. That was really fun. And like, I don’t like obviously it kind of sounds like a bit like showboating. Like I was like at the very I was able to. Yeah, I was. Yeah. You know, I was I was in class pretty early on it those forever. No, but it’s you know, I was there fairly early on when like the biggest room you would see would be like five hundred people like and that’s like you would see them going, oh my gosh, it’s crazy that many people in one room typically you’d see like a hundred maybe if you had a five hundred room, it’d be because someone famous was and they’re part of it or like a really big influencer. But now, like you would like the Mark Zuckerberg when that happens, it’s like the biggest one they had. They had not they have like multiple rooms that were all to capacity. And I think it was like I think the capacity is like three thousand or eight thousand, something like that. People it’s I think it’s like three thousand, but it’s like in there in like different rooms. So now it’s just like a metric boatload of people are part of the clubhouse. And what’s happening is the thing that’s happening with what’s Instagram starting and see now, which is just like a bunch of people telling you to like get into like forex trading and like being, you know, telling you to to do to like trade crypto.

[00:11:09] And this is how you should trade crypto, follow my like daily my day trading list, all that stuff that’s starting to come into their into the fray now, which it’s everywhere. So like my my fear, though, is that, like, if you’re someone who is. The clubhouse and the algorithm just like pumps shit towards you, you’re going to get these like forex traders who are like telling you how you can make like ten thousand dollars in a week and that’s 10000 dollars in a week. Well, not just that. Like, that’s obviously a worst case scenario of someone actually falling for it, but I think that that makes clubhouse look really bad when, like that’s like the forefront of their stuff. When you have all these, like, you know, quote unquote, influencers, just like, you know, telling you to trade crypto trade, forex, trade day, trade stocks or whatever it is, penny stocks. And that’s kind of what it’s leaning into. So I think that what it is, is really cool. But they have to fix the algorithm because right now it’s pushing a lot of that stuff forward. And obviously you can follow certain groups that will kind of push the stuff that you want more. So, like, I follow a lot of, like, you know, marketing a lot of data. And then I also follow, like, mindfulness and stuff like that. But like, you know, there’s a lot of cool things you can do.

[00:12:22] A lot of groups can be a part of, I think, lighthouse’s rad. But do I think that clubhouse is going to be the clubhouse that stays for the next, like two years?

[00:12:32] No, I think that someone’s going to make a better version of it and they’re probably just gonna end up buying a clubhouse.

[00:12:37] Yeah, I mean, the reality is, is usually first movers in a market fail. The founders of clubhouse, though, they filled out multiple ventures before this was actually their first successful venture. And it’s pretty inspiring to hear the story and how they actually made it. Yes. And it’s cool how they made it like this exclusive feeling and had these high profile individuals first. You know, it’s it’s a complete free speech. You can have any conversations you want to have on there. It’s a fascinating concept. And the reason why I really like it is because we’re now an information age where we talked about the past. Like, you know, formal education has its own pitfalls because it’s not moving as fast as the markets are. There’s other individuals that are like other opportunities out there, like bootcamps, all these things. But what if you actually get to hear from somebody who is like a CEO of a company and they’re giving you advice on, you know, marketing tips or, you know, actual market applications and you can get this information when you didn’t in the past. And there’s no more direct barriers on your own income disparity or demographic groups. You can access this information as long as you.

[00:13:36] Well, I guess the disparity is you have to have an iOS device, but until what is it like maybe something mid-May, anybody can access it.

[00:13:44] So God have mercy on fucking clubhouse when all the Android users can get on, do just shitty microphones as far as the eye can see. OK, all right.

[00:13:54] But yeah.

[00:13:55] So I mean, the biggest the biggest thing there for me is like like I said, you can you can get access to information very, very quickly and efficiently. And I think the important part is it’s taken the world of podcasting, which has become oversaturated and made in a forum where people can have those open conversations, like the legitimate reason for a podcast is for open conversations, talking about things that you might not talk about in everyday aspect, but from people that have understanding of it. And it can actually influence and teach you about it. Yeah, but that does go into the realms of misinformation or these different realms. But you can easily go that route. Same thing with tick tock saying the same thing with YouTube, like YouTube easily. If you’re watching the wrong videos, you’re going to go through the rabbit hole and it goes I mean, I’ve been watching the have you watched the. The document was not documented, but the series on HBO, Max, for like the Q and on Kuhnen movement.

[00:14:46] No, I just meant it is a good fantastic four.

[00:14:50] Out of the six episodes of reality, I watched all four of them. And it will scare you quite a bit on exactly how people get radicalized, how they get radicalized, how you get pulled into. Is that box that did that or who did the. It was I’m not sure, but it’s HBO’s own the rights to it. But that’s the stuff I’m worried about when it comes to things like clubhouse overall. Right. It’s like you can create a group.

[00:15:10] Obviously, they use HCN for a reason because that’s not going to get shut down and they found ways around it. But that does scare me a little bit, right, when you can have.

[00:15:20] I mean, free speech should be free speech, and it’s important because the more ideas are out there, you at least know what exists and you can fight against them and have a conversation and see if somebody believes or doesn’t believe you. But I think clubhouse can also cause the same problem as long as they have to, like, look at their algorithms, monitor it, make sure that there’s not a lot of hate speech and stuff like that on this platform. It’s still, you know, it’s positive information. It’s actually benefiting people and benefiting society. That’s what I think is going to create infrastructure for success. Yeah, for a platform. But I do think that YouTube is actually working on a solution for it. You have Twitter working on Instagram or something, right? So I could see Twitter being the dominant one because they’re really kind of have that forum. And I know they had way in the past, they did have a platform kind of like this. It just never worked. They just didn’t know how to scale it out. But I think now they can leverage clubhouse. The thing is, there’s so many Twitter users already, it’s pretty easy for them to build out a platform there.

[00:16:16] They’re already launching theirs. They’re so certain people already have it accessible to them so they can do it again. We’re like, you can forget what they call it, but it literally is the same thing as clubhouse, the little room that you can go in and just have a conversation and listen to that stuff. I think you bring up a good point here. The tricky part with clubhouse is like with Twitter, with Facebook, obviously, you know, anything that has like text based information sharing is fairly simple to to moderate because you could just create an algorithm that scans for certain words and scans for certain sentiment analysis and then just takes it out, takes out that post or tags that a user or something like that. You know, how does that moderation occur when you have free flowing conversation? It’s a lot harder. You know, I’m sure that there’s going to be like it had a clubhouse been openly accessible during like like in the lead up to the twenty the twenty twenty election. And then pushing closer towards the insurrection that happened on January 6th. Would clubhouse have been a tool utilized for, like, you know, whatever the hell, you know, insert whatever theory you want here? And like, how on earth would you moderate that? I think I think a lot of us is cool. What’s novel? But you got like this is what you got to kind of think about. It’s like you got to think about how moderation is going to be happening because it’s limited right now. And they did run for for a reason. It’s limited. People can get into it right now. It’s invite only. I don’t know what’s it’s going to be like when Android gets it. But at that point, you just got to open it up. I feel like if I was like, why are you going to make it invite? Only if now anybody and everybody can be a part of it. And I don’t know, obviously, they have their own kind of agenda they have there. But I’m interested to see where they’re going to be in like a year or two. I think that I think it’s going to be around, but I think that they really have to focus on, like being able to have like moderators having even like a reporting system for users that makes that’s like kind of like how I’m trying to think about it. So, you know, like war zone, like all. Do you how like you can report somebody and they’re like literally email you and like tell you like, hey, the person who reported got banned like like, like, like that would be cool to see. I know that. I believe Twitter also has it. It’s like if you can if you report a post it’ll tell you like, hey, the post you reported got got deleted. You know, something like that where it’s like self moderation, but with still a bit of, like, human analysis behind it, yeah, I think is kind of the way they have to go. I honestly haven’t looked and I’ve never had a reason to look at to report somebody or like go into the kind of nitty gritty, that stuff on clubhouse. I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s already kind of there, but I think it needs to be robust by the time they by the time May, mid-May comes around.

[00:19:10] Yeah. Like, I, I, I really do believe that verbal communication is the future of social media because people are already going that way, like 30 Postino stories and sharing stories, all of the things. And you can actually then have a direct conversation with people. But I do think clubhouse and any platform is going to have to figure out, yeah, consistent moderation, because this is not like it’s different for like we’re making an episode on Twitch and Twitch has their own moderation and stuff like that. They are very strict on. But then let’s say we post on YouTube. They also have a very good moderation system that they do on. And then if we post it on like simple and pass it out to Spotify and stuff, they also have a really good moderation. But if you’re talking in real time and that’s it, I just I just think that’s going to have a lot of interesting repercussions to it. And the bigger you get, the more kind of dark side of any social platform exists, which I think we’ll we’ll start scaling out. But on the positive lens, I do think it’s going to be fascinating to see how it creates new strategies for social media strategist. Right. I think it can be very fascinating how businesses utilize it, because the businesses that figure it out, tock talk, they’re killing it right now. So I do want to see how businesses start using it, because I do think there’s a lot of cool avenues that they can do. For example, just, you know, CEO chats and stuff like that. It’s very easy to do. They’re already doing these conversations. Just have fireside chats with other businesses, I think if you’re selling a product.

[00:20:37] And you’re not and you have access to clubhouse and you’re not on clubhouse asking for feedback for your product, like why the hell not? Like that’s what I’d be doing if I was selling a product, I’d be a hundred percent just be like, you know, like you just put it on Twitter or something like that, like, hey, you know, we’re we’re holding an open forum. And all of us, if you have an invite, here’s a link. Come and give us feedback on the thing. And like, even when you’re in there, just be like, hey, here’s a code that you can use, like right now for this time. Like, if you do not have the product, here’s like a 10 percent off so you can buy the product in the clubhouse, 10 or some B.S. code. And then as soon as the clubhouse ends, you and the discount code and stuff like that, I think would be fantastic. If you if you have a product, it’s a little bit trickier if you’re kind of like us. We’re just like a consultancy in an agency where our product is our service. But I think if you are a product, you can for sure leverage clubhouse and make a really substantial way. And I have not seen it. So like, let’s do it. Like, if you’re if anything, if you’re selling soap, if you’re selling T-shirts, if you’re selling water bottles, you’re selling anything, go on the clubhouse and just ask for feedback from people who already have your product, people who follow you so you can have direct conversation with those people like that’s that to me is really rad like that. That’s the thing that I haven’t seen yet. And I think that can be leveraged really, really effectively is like if someone if I bought something like for example, like if it’s something that I that I bought recently that I’m really jazzed about trying to think you’re.

[00:21:56] I don’t even know I don’t even know what I’m trying to I was the last thing I ever purchased in my whole life, I don’t know, like let’s say I got this quote from, like this like small supplier in like San Bernardino. Right. He makes like custom like s.b like t shirts, which are red. And he had like a clubhouse saying, I would love to just be on there and be like, hey, man, I love the design. Fantastic. Your shirts are really itchy.

[00:22:16] Just you just get better shirts. That’s I love. I’ll buy another one, I’ll buy one more. And I don’t have both shirts but just get a little less itchy shirt like even like something like that, you know, would be cool. And I think that clubhouse can get leverage really effectively for something like that.

[00:22:31] No, I think that’s fascinating because one other part when it comes to the startup world is customer discovery. So like let’s say you have a startup idea. And I do think this is where any aspiring entrepreneurs or even if you’re trying to figure out career paths and stuff like that, go on to the clubhouse. Right. And you can go into different chat rooms that exist, talking around the market that you’re trying to build your your business around. Listen to the conversations there and listen to sentiment and feedback and learn from that.

[00:22:58] And then, well, do we have a nice little cameo going on during the. We didn’t I. But but yeah.

[00:23:06] I mean, go, go, go onto clubhouse chat rooms and figure out like the different market or businesses you want to work at or you want to build a business around right here. Listen to what people are talking about. Listen to buzzwords. They’re saying listen to like all these things in the conversations and try to find problems, because if you’re trying to get hired, listen to what the issues in that industry are and try to figure out solutions for it. That’s how you get a job very quickly. And if you’re trying to build a company, listen to consistent sentiment around that problem. Then after a while and you’re building a little bit of traction, then build your own clubhouse, invite people that are enthusiasts of your idea and have them discuss it with you in open forum. Easiest way to have that open forum conversations. Not like you have to people submitting questions to you and your answer, like you can talk in real time, answer those questions, get that sentiment, and then, yeah, just do like a constant basis, like every week have as a user feedback session that you just have for an hour. You talk with your customers. Even if you have three or four people that show up, that’s enough for you to get really specific user feedback. Yeah, but you might not be able to get that makes your business better and better and better. And then ask for somebody trying to go into the professional world. The more clubhouse you can actually network with those individuals, talk with them if you ask something that’s super good and yeah, get their Twitter or you can get their LinkedIn. So imagine if you like, ask a really good question. They’re fascinated by a follow up with linked a message like, by the way, I saw you in Clubhouse is a great conversation. I asked this question. I really appreciate your answer tied into that. Connect with them. Right. So you can leverage it for networking. You can’t really do that with Instagram. You can’t really do that with ticktock. There’s no direct communication. So I think that’s where I want to see the future of things like clubhouse start going. But I just don’t think that people figure it out. I don’t think there’s enough users to have like them figure out these little tricks that you can do, like these old growth hacks that you do on those platforms themselves.

[00:24:49] Yeah, I know. One service that we use for our proposal writing is we those do. If we those like the CEO because it’s such it’s such a startup company that like I get emails that are just like, you know, schedule time to chat with the CEO for thirty minutes. And I’m just like, that’s cool. But like and like maybe I’ll do kind of look into that. But like if he was just like oh like a clubhouse I had hundred percent just pop in, I’d be like, yeah man I’ve been using your stuff since before there was a free option, you know, like and now you know, we’re using it, we’re, we’re giving them feedback and stuff like that. Like I know. Like myself.

[00:25:27] Nikil Nick have you given any feedback to those yet. You have feedback. Yeah. Like any like tickets. Have you given any feedback to them. I haven’t. We haven’t.

[00:25:34] I need to because I have a lot of a lot of things. They do a lot better. They’re really responsive and they’re working hard because like a lot of the things I know that we had issue in the beginning have already been resolved. But there are some things that really do piss me off still. No.

[00:25:46] Yeah, it’s such like a brand new product that like and they have such a small base of, like, paying users that they’re like taking everything that people do not like into consideration right now, which is cool because like being early on on on that software, we can basically we’re not basically we can we can steer the ship in a direction we get grandfathered in with the cost.

[00:26:04] We do like shout out to our mentor because we got that shit before, like anybody knew what it was. And I’m not going to say how much we pay per month, but I’m just going to put out there that it now costs a thousand dollars a year and we’re paying like pennies to the dollar when it comes to that. So, like, that’s why you want to jump in early. But you also want to get feedback because they they they appreciate it can create a relationship with that hundred million.

[00:26:26] Yeah. Because if you if you create a relationship with those companies and you create that kind of feedback loop or like you give them cool stuff that they’re doing, we, we can you can then build a relationship where like you can then be like, what are they called again, like like something partners.

[00:26:42] Like obviously a partner but like a like a certified vendor. Like a certified users.

[00:26:46] Yeah. Yeah. Like a dedicated vendor. Yeah.

[00:26:48] We’re like if, if like they ever have like an event or something like that, you could be a speaker at it. Mean we’ve used this since the beginning and it’s boy howdy. Have we gotten clients. You know, it’s like and yeah, I don’t know, I think that’s cool.

[00:27:01] And so I think that if you are running even like a software that people are using a product, go on clubhouse, chat about it and just get feedback, get as much and you bring up a good point, as much as like one person in there, that one person is a paying customer theoretically. So take what they have in consideration and talk with them, have a carpool conversation. You’d be surprised, I think, just how much good stuff you can get from one feedback session, even if it’s just one individual.

[00:27:31] Yeah. I mean, the other thing that I think is interesting about clubhouse is actually puts a rationalizes social media. So what I mean by that is you have Instagram, you have Facebook, you have YouTube and all these things.

[00:27:44] And people have like hundreds of thousands of followers, but they only get a little bit of engagement and only a couple of people are liking their posts. And a couple of people are commenting on their posts. When you’re using clubhouse, it’s the people that are in the room that are your social media following. There’s no B.S. behind it. So if you only have three people behind that, you don’t have clout. Like, you can’t just do this. Like a lot of Instagram accounts. I see this all the time. They have like fifteen thousand followers, but they get like thirty likes because you can easily inflate that right. When you go into the clubhouse, it rewards actual content.

[00:28:14] If you’re providing value for people and it’s engaging, it’s interesting. People will watch it, people will listen to it and then they will want to react to it. Right. So I think that’s the fascinating part about clubhouse as well as I think it’s going to hopefully what we’ll see. Like, I think there’s a lot of negative lenses that we don’t know about yet, but I do hopefully think it’s going to slowly bring down issues with these dark patterns that exist on other social media platforms that create this really depressive like environment, that people suffer from anxiety and depression and all these other things that exist out there because they’re so caught up on the number of followers instead of like the actual social value that you’re supposed to be getting out of social networking.

[00:28:52] Do you can I can I just say this? I am I think like when you compare MySpace early days, like MySpace, peak, Facebook peak, Instagram peak, Twitter, I think will forever be in a peak like that with Twitter just obsessed with Twitter, Twitter, dot com, shinobi website.

[00:29:12] I would I would gladly pay five dollars a month for Twitter dot com, but like in and clubhouse. So so basically if you take all those and like observe how much irreparable damage was done to like middle school and high schoolers, like, you have to look like this and you have to look like that compared to clubhouse antics, which are entirely accepting for the most part. Obviously, you have like something like tick off. That’s pretty brutal. Yes. There’s some parts like overall look at the overall picture here. I was talking also going up to Elizabeth today. I was just like not a guest list. My wife was I was talking to my wife about it day. And I was just like, I honestly think that, like, tech talk is like like I’ve learned like I don’t have I don’t use tech talk, but like I used I use Twitter to look at tech stocks and it’s like the amount of information that I’ve gotten from them that are just like so wholesome and like so like mental health positive. And all the stuff I said to the clubhouse, the clubhouse is very much like they have like they have like rooms that are just dedicated to you. Just go in there and like spew all of your your guts out. And then people are just like, hey, it’s all right. Like, that’s cool. Like that’s never I don’t I’ve never existed on on any other platforms I could post Instagram photo or something like that.

[00:30:33] And then everybody commenting like I support you, like you’re most likely you don’t get likes, but it won’t get engagement, it won’t get like that actual conversation behind, which is not going to solve the problem, which is like you’re trying to get it out, but you can’t because like nobody’s reacting to and then you have like, picked up duets, which like you can literally like through video and audio, respond to somebody, take talk.

[00:30:57] And then you have obviously clubhouse, which you can have a full conversation with somebody addressing the problem there. Me, Nikil and Heidi made a room like a week or two ago.

[00:31:08] I forget at this point in time, as a matter and one of the kills old supervisors or bosses was in it like he joined it. And I just like the kid was like, oh, my God, I think when I would like you, like, it’s my old boss, like he like on slackers like that. And I was just like I was like, all right, he’s not your boss now.

[00:31:27] So I was like, well, let’s see where this goes.

[00:31:30] So I was just like a man like we just because we were talking like us three beforehand and I brought him in, I was like, hey, man, just like out of general curiosity, is there like anything that like that you’re like going through the you want to talk about and like workwise like you find like off your chest.

[00:31:43] And he did. He likes you sort of venting to us. And I was just like I like I like myself because I was just like I was like so giggly to myself. I was just like, are you kidding me? Like, I have no idea who this guy is. But he’s like. Using his, like, literal, like days stress onto us, and I was just like, this is fucking great, like this is fantastic. Like the fact that, like the dude like because you’re hearing voices, you you are more likely to be OK with letting your guard down and just talk to an individual, like have a conversation with somebody and then like. Yeah, and then we just crack jokes like laugh and stuff like that. And then and then he followed me and then I followed him like it’s like that’s cool. Like I think that I think is like the cool little nugget of the golden nugget of the clubhouse and I think tick as well. But I think clubhouse more so. Yeah.

[00:32:29] And that’s why I’m very confident that.

[00:32:34] Clubhouse, yeah, like a clubhouse itself. We’ll see how long it lasts, but the concept of clubhouse is here to stay and other social media platforms are going to have to catch up to it and kind of change the way that we are going, because the evolution of social media does change. It’s kind of like in seven year cycles, to be honest. It’s always about seven years. It’s every every about seven years you hit a peak. They try to innovate a little bit. They have like three year time span after that. And then they just kind of fall off the map. That tends to be kind of the more consistent is when it Instagram officially like become Instagram, because it was it was before that in 2008 it was being developed. Yeah, I think 2010, 2012. 2012, yeah. I think it’s yeah. About twenty. It was before I went, I started at UCR so it had to be like Yeah. To you I think it was twenty twelve.

[00:33:16] I think it was like, I think it was like twenty ten when it was like a thing. Yeah. And then I think it was like twenty twelve or twenty fourteen in that window when Facebook bought it for like one was at one point two billion dollars.

[00:33:26] Yeah. So it is about seven years until it hits its peak because it peaked out in twenty seventeen. That’s when it had the most users.

[00:33:32] Oh yeah. And Instagram was like was shit for a good while. Yeah. That was like, like I remember like I was you, I tried Instagram for a little bit and was like this is dumb. And then Facebook bought it and then the algorithm hit and I was like Oh this is nice. Oh it’s nice. Yes. That’s exactly what I want. And for some reason, Instagram just things that I want to see a bunch of freakin dudes just lifting massive weights, which I’m OK with, actually. Look, here’s the thing. I click on it, though. I’m like, man, fucking get that shit. But I think that’s I think if I was to go to my discover it just be like computer parts, dudes deadlifting and dogs, that’d be those would be the three things that would just get fed into my discover feed as of right now, which I mean cool the algorithm algorithms. Fine it works. Yeah. The three D triple D not Dayna’s dives and drive ins but my triple D deadlifts deadlifts dudes and dogs that of.

[00:34:29] So what do you think is the next thing when it comes to like what clubhouse should or there. Do you think they’re going to roll out. Like what do you think are some features because like I think some of the features they should do it similar to like what Twitch does. Right. Like you can give emotes, you can give like these kinds of things are like give social kind of back and forth like within rooms or reward people or give them some kind of status in a way within the platform. So, for example, if you’re consistent, like the more you’re engaging on it, like the more you’re giving these conversations and leading talks and all these kinds of things, some more people listen to you that you can get access to, like VIP rooms and stuff like that. Because if they do open the floodgates right and everybody can access it, they still do need to feel the exclusive feeling to it’s a certain extent. Otherwise you’re going to lose some value from the people that have love, that exclusive feeling as they try to go on to other platforms or you want to know what’s in the shot right now. So I’m not going to know you’re going to peek at it. But what do you think is the next thing that we have to do?

[00:35:28] That’s fine. I think that have to figure out a way to make money, because right now there’s no monetization. That’s what I was going to ask is like, how are they actually making like what is their business model like waiting for advertising or their business model is they have a lot of people on there right now, which is, you know, step one, step one of a social network type.

[00:35:44] Yeah, that’s that’s where that’s how they’re getting their funding now, because a lot of people are are on it. And so VCs are just shelling money at them. I think that they have to come up with a subscription model. I think that be that be like. So either they have to come up with a really unique monetization scheme or they just come up with subscriptions where it’s like if someone’s like like there’s people that have like hundreds of thousands of followers, like I I’m almost willing to guarantee you that if that person with hundreds or thousands of followers becomes like one of their subscriber people are like an affiliate, whatever they want to call it. And it’s only like I can’t like a twitch as it was like five bucks a month. But maybe they do like two dollars a month or a dollar a month or something like that. They have like different tiers because truth be told, I wouldn’t like I would be hard like I would really have to like the person to pay five dollars a month. I just hear them talk. Yeah. When like podcast for free, you know, for the most part with Twitter at least you like some visual stuff and there’s like some fun things that you can do and some streamers do like really like eccentric stuff, you know. So I think like a dollar or two dollars would be kind of I think that golden zone of how much people are willing to pay. That’d be one thing that I can see happening, sponsored chat rooms where it’s just like the room is like, I don’t know, like, you know, who’s like a who’s like a sponge that everyone always bolts place. Oh, sure. I sponsors a room and then you are a part of the room and or like a clubhouse gets cut, you as like the host, whatever, because it gets a cut. I think that would be a cool way to go about doing it. It just really depends. But I can’t see a world advertising unless it’s in that way. Advertise rooms. I can’t see a way that advertising would make sense for clubhouse at all besides, again, sponsored rooms.

[00:37:32] So I, I would have to disagree with the advertising side. I actually do think that they can leverage advertising quite a bit. So one thing that they can do, I just don’t know what their data privacy is right now. I have no idea. And I think this would actually kind of get into hot shit, but like just an Excel sheet. So what they really they could do is like you could leverage EHI to take, like, conversations that people are having. Right. And then the buzzwords and then pitching it to people and then cross-reference that data with like a Facebook or a Google or somebody else. Right. Create a data platform where like they can anonymously get the data, but it’s still it tracked and then they can create complementary data sets and then sell that because the more people are talking, so much is you’re going at the the big data side of it.

[00:38:15] Yeah, OK. The big data side, because think about it.

[00:38:17] If you’re having let’s say there’s a million active users per day, a million people talking, we talk faster than we type. We’re saying things that we might not type. You’re opening up about things that you might not type, just like he boss. Yeah, exactly. So what happens out of that, right, is you can then take that audio and then you can pull from that words that people are saying it’s not going to happen in the beginning because right now, machine learning, it’s not like perfected. But you can take those conversations, figure out what people care about, what rooms they’ve been into, who they listen to, who influences them. You understand influencer marketing. You understand what they want to buy. You understand they’re buying trends. It’s quite scary. I don’t know what their data privacy is, but that’s the reality of conversations. The more data you’re throwing out there and we’re throwing more data through conversation than we ever will through text or video or to photo. Yeah, you can leverage that data to create a data center that then you can either have your own way of advertising, which I don’t believe they would do, because that doesn’t make sense. Or then you can partner with a Facebook. I don’t know if they would either or partner with Google.

[00:39:19] I don’t know if they’re gonna do that either, because these guys are kind of rebellious. They don’t really want to be tied into those companies. So I don’t know if they would. But that is that is a really easy monetization scheme that makes the platform free. But it’s really not free. It’s running the Google model. Everything is here you go. You have it for free. But I’m just going to take all your data. I know every single damn thing that you do. Yeah.

[00:39:39] So, I mean, if that’s the case by Dansky, just buy them. Yeah, I don’t see that to me makes a lot of sense. Like if if, if that’s a thing that maybe is, is possible and I don’t see why it wouldn’t be. I don’t see like I think the one the person that would buy them that makes the most sense would be buy dance. Yeah. Because that why not integrate it with Tick-Tock in some way, shape or form.

[00:39:58] Yeah. And I mean like I think that would make the most sense actually because it’s the only platform that is not currently creating these chatrooms where all of the competitors, big tech companies are trying to make these chat room functionalities. Facebook has one, Twitter has one. So and if you think about it too, that’s actually a smart move for the founders because their entire strategy is acquisition there. They do not care about making money. They care about getting to the point to be acquired. So their voices are happy, everybody’s happy, and whoever gets it will be very happy because they have a platform that they can get so much data from. So I do think that probably is the long term strategy for them. But I don’t know, like I think it’s too early. I want to see what happens once they let Android users come on when they allow me to come onto the platform. Let’s see what I want to see this world of clubhouse, is that right?

[00:40:43] Yeah, I think I, I, if I was a betting man, I would say that around holidays this year is going to be like a clubhouse because that’s going to that’s during like like summertime. People are out doing stuff like holidays. People are at home just trying to like figure outlets. I if I was the clubhouse and I was still going through this, like mowing, I need aquisition kind of thing, I would want to get a quiet way sooner rather than later. Like I’m talking like mid next year at the latest get acquired, if not this year, get acquired just because I think that monetization thing is going to be a big deal. There’s going to be a point where VCs are going to be like, OK, well, you’ve you’ve we’ve been giving you money for about two years now. Like, what’s when are we going to get some some something back?

[00:41:33] Yeah. I mean, most venture capital is going to look at it. Either they’re either going to look at a three to five year track if it’s an acquisition pool, depending on its software.

[00:41:42] So it’s about three to five years. Or then if it’s a they’re more looking at the long term kind of play and creating kind of like the IPO or long term acquisition, like a big time acquisition, then it’s more the seven to 10 year out. But they usually want a three to five years. They’re trying to at least get something, get something back, but they bet on twenty companies. Out of the twenty companies, only five of them have to succeed anyway.

[00:42:01] So I’m sure clubhouse is right now a very attractive in that because I think it’s very gambling bet. But if it does go the right way and the right company acquires them, it’ll be a massive acquisition deal. So it’s quite interesting to hear kind of understand what’s what what is going on, because I do think it’s going to really kind of reshape the entire social media landscape overall.

[00:42:25] Yeah, yeah, I’m excited for clubhouse. I said I, I go in there just to listen more than anything, very rarely end up actually like piping up, which is surprising considering I love to hear my voice so much, but, um. But yeah, I usually just go in there just to listen to stuff because people on there are usually a lot smarter than me, more often than not. So yeah, it’s fun to just listen and just like hear what other people’s opinions are about certain things and certain marketing trends and stuff like that. I mean, I know I’m pro clubhouse. I think it’s going to be cool. I think I think the future of it’s going to be fine. Would you care to. What what do you think you’re going to talk about when you get your clubhouse? What do you want to talk about once once the masses are the peons, you know, are allowed in the clubhouse?

[00:43:15] She’s so I would probably focus on three different areas. So one of them is digital marketing, like us talking about digital marketing, talking about not even digital marketing, digital strategy. You think of your entire digital infrastructure and then like giving advice to people, having conversations, people especially like social impact organizations or early stage start ups and just having interesting conversations about like how they trying to enter into the market, what are some approaches are having, what’s working, what’s not working? How should they think about it? Because it’s going to help us to understand. Also, we can provide value to people, but it’s also going to help us think what is the future digital strategy, because it changes every year, every year, new platforms, new digital infrastructures. It’s never the same. The second thing I’ll be really fascinated by is what is the next emerging tech? I’m I’m obsessed with that all the time. So I want to listen to people who know what the hell they’re talking about when it comes to things like block chain, things like A.I., things like how you can leverage the machine learning algorithms into different kind of ecosystems. That’s that’s huge for me. I want to understand that as well, because that also helps us in our business and where we want to go when it comes to our business. And if we want to create some brands and some businesses, we know what kind of areas are good to kind of invest into or build out of. Yeah. And then the third thing is anything for sure we’re going to have like one just dedicated audio because there are a lot of audio heads out there and I want to talk with them. I understand right now, like, what are they spending money on what they want to do? That might tie a little bit also into EA Sports and talking to some sports gamers and where they think the future of gaming is going to be. But it’s going to allow for customer discovery and early customers and getting that feedback and creating product feature sets and all these kinds of things. So I see a lot of value out of clubhouse. And I, I think it’s great because you can just dedicate like, oh, every Friday at this time, I’m going to have a chat room open. You can have three people or five people in there. Let’s just come and talk about audio, which sounds boring, but when you talk with people that have audio, they’ll really get into it, which is so fascinating to me because the more I talk with people that are obsessed with audio, the more I’ve learned is that they all like different things, like they like these small, like nuances one likes and someone likes. And I am exactly pretty much some people like Bass that literally breaks their spine. You know, there’s there’s different levels of it. But it’s fascinating to talk with different perspectives because we’re so stuck in our own bubbles all the time and like our friend groups and everything like that. So you might not even think about how somebody in like like Berlin who is like a straight a hard core like basehead. Yeah. Is thinking about audio versus somebody who’s in like, you know, New York thinking about it or like different market areas because we can’t get access to that. But if you can just talk to them in real time, I can ask them questions or they can ask us questions and we can answer it. So I’m excited to get on clubhouse. And it’s actually really perfect timing for me because I have no reason to be on it for the next month and a half. But then after that is when I really want to start getting engaged on anyways.

[00:46:07] Is that what you tell yourself? Because you don’t have an iOS device? I don’t got a reason to be on there right now. That’s fine. Or that pretty much actually. OK, fair enough.

[00:46:15] I got the delusion I guess there. Yeah, I always tell myself that I was like one of these days I’m just going to start like spouting like like like I’m going to start like a fucking like a socialist revolution clubhouse. I never do because I never want to. I’m always afraid that like something like right wingers are going to be like, how dare you? And I just I just got time for that. My brain automatically just goes it just like, can I kick people like like immediately, just like kicking people.

[00:46:43] Free speech, man, you’re going to bring that up. I’m going to be the first one to jump in and be like capitalism. Baby, let’s go. Let’s have that conversation. Shall not come out right. Fucking tap on the three little dots on their name and that here. But speaking about that subject, I think that’s actually a good transition into Amazon and what is going on. So for those that don’t know what’s going on, Amazon right now is.

[00:47:04] Amazon and the workers of Amazon right now are in a dispute when it comes to Atlanta, Georgia, and it is dispute, to say the least, to say the least, it is a very, very important, pivotal moment in our U.S. history when it comes to labor rights. The reason why is because if what happens in Atlanta, Georgia, the workers win with a union and can unionize, it will change the landscape of how supply chain networks work as well as how businesses operate. To the better, to the worst, there’s conversations there, I think there are some elements of labor unions and I brought this up before, there are negative sides of it. But I do think there’s more pro sides to it as well that aren’t talked about enough and are muffled because the US economy runs on dollars. It doesn’t run on how much you’re making per hour or if you can even afford to live. So right now, what’s happening Atlanta, Georgia, is they moved them Amazon warehouse over. And this is a consistent case. Amazon workers get paid minimum of fifteen dollars an hour, which sounds pretty nice if you think about it. But the entire argument is that they’re trying to do economic development in the areas that they’re putting these facilities in, which then destroy all the other businesses in that same market when they build it. So now there’s less competition means that they have actually the income disparity and they can say like, oh, we can pay this. And if you don’t want to work here, we’ll swap another person in that spot because we know that these are the only opportunities exist, increases unnatural. It doesn’t like the concept of capitalism is a free market. You can compete against each other and people can choose. And I, I love that concept because it does create innovation. It does create more opportunities for people. But where we’re at right now is cronyism, which is actually the worst side of it doesn’t help anybody where it’s that we’re we have socialist ideals towards corporations, but not towards the workers. We we kind of demonize the worker, but then we look at the company as that’s the best the greatest thing in the world.

[00:48:57] So. As of right now, obviously, they’re trying to unionize in Georgia when it comes to that Amazon and even by the administration’s pushing back on it, we have a couple other people that are actively talking about it. I don’t know if you know who killer Mike is. I do. I love Killer Mike. I listen to his speech about it. It was fantastic.

[00:49:17] And he was he’s he’s a he’s a business owner. He he understands that entire area. You’ve grown up in that entire area. And I think he explains it very, very well, how Amazon treats the people there and how it’s gone to the level where the new CEO of Amazon is even talking crap about.

[00:49:34] Well, so he is like the CEO. He’s not like the CEO CEO.

[00:49:39] He’s like the CEO of like of like I guess like personal development, like of people. Basically, he’s like the CEO that deals with like the people facing side of it. Yeah, man. I mean, it’s the workers at Amazon aren’t mad about making fifty dollars an hour. They’re mad about the fact that, you know, you have to like the working conditions, which is, you know, it’s not fair for the fifteen dollars an hour wage. Yeah. I mean the fact that you don’t really have a break, the fact that people are like literally peeing in bottles also literally forget about the peeing in the peeing the bottles. Awful, really fucking bad shouldn’t be happening. But delivery drivers are like pooping in the in the delivery car because they cannot stop to do it. They just pull over really quick, do it in the car like a bag, and then they just I keep driving. Like, the fact that that’s happening is like she’s like that’s like that’s like next level, like looking at getting packages out as opposed to looking at people. And, you know, like it’s I think that’s that’s the big thing that they forget about. The fact that, like, the big push, like Amazon pays their workers a living wage. Fifteen dollars an hour. Oh, look, that’s what Elizabeth Warren and like all these people are talking about an hour, we’re like, sure, like, that’s fine.

[00:50:53] But like like you say, when you create, like, company cities, which is like back in like the Standard Oil days and like the 20s or 30s, not that or excuse me, the tens in the 20s back in 1910 when like one company was the was the employment hub for the entire city, literally company cities. It like at first it sounds really cool. Was like, OK, we all we all work in the same place, we’re all in the same place. But when a company goes down that entire city collapses because it’s gone. Detroit, literally. Look at Detroit, all all everything used to be literally the golden goose of the United States. And now it’s it’s really bad there because there’s because the company just left, because it was cheaper to go, you know, to go manufacture somewhere else than it was to do it in the States. But I think that that’s like the big thing you got to focus on here is like people are not complaining about the money. People are not complaining about the benefits, but we’re not complaining about that stuff. That’s fine. But they’re complaining about is the fact that the working conditions are awful. The brakes are basically nonexistent. And like Amazon, like like like they’re pushing out like we’ve seen like the Amazon News Twitter handle. No. Oh, my God, dude. Like, so the Amazon CEO, whatever the fuck his team is, the CEO of people or whatever, that dude on Twitter. And then there’s an official Amazon Twitter handle that’s called Amazon News. And right now, dude, and they’re like they’re doing so many nasty things. So this is the whole drama started with them.

[00:52:22] Is somebody somebody linked and talked about?

[00:52:27] OK, so the CEO dude said something and someone replied to him and said, like, your aren’t your people pissing in bottles? And then the Amazon News twit had to reply to that person and said, you don’t really believe that the thing about those things is real. Right. And then, like, started going off on like a weird tirade about how, like, they’re like one of the most fair and equitable employers in the United States and all this and all that and then like that just got off a huge firestorm because it’s like you don’t like the fact that a company page flat flat out told, like a person, a journalist, hey, that thing isn’t real when, like, there’s multiple sightings, all documentation, documentation of everything is like literally living in, like, some weird, like, dystopia dystopia kind of mentality that Amazon is going. And apparently this is like through like the grapevine. But it was Jeffrey KISS’s my man, Jeff Bezos, who ended up like ordering that stuff when he was just like basically like in internal memos. He was just like, we’re being way too soft on this unionization stuff, like we need to, like, really go at them. And that’s when, like the Amazon News, Twitter and I started getting really negative and really, like, antagonistic. Yeah. And then they started making fake Amazon worker accounts. That would be like I yeah, I work at this warehouse. I don’t think we should unionize because blah blah blah, blah, blah. And like it’s like they’re literally making fake accounts, like the accounts for brand new. They’re using like it’s like a website I forget to call, but it generates faces like the website can go on like literally creates a face that doesn’t exist using like Ehi and stuff like that. And they’re using those are the one that I saw. It was hilarious is they used they cropped in on a picture of dude perfect like one of the one of the main guys. You see that when they crafted on like the main guy from Dude. Perfect. Yeah. A famous person. So it’s like I have to do is like what are you doing. Like this is like you’re obviously a fake account and they’re like spouting off all this like anti unionization stuff and how like that’s all awful. And one of the stuff that’s coming out a lot more now is and then I wasn’t even aware of was like to the extent of like the amount of like slave labor that was going on in the warehouses. So, like, they would get 30 minute breaks to workers. So the worker gets a 30 minute break. But what you don’t like process and really think about when you hear like a worker gets a 30 minute break, like, you know, but I think they get multiple, 30 minute breaks, obviously. But I want to work against 30 minute break in your head. You’re processing it like, oh, that’s nice. They’re getting breaks, you know. But what is not being told here is a mass of workers get a 30 minute break. And for some reason, Amazon, which which can develop a store where you walk in and walk out without ever interacting with the cashier and it pays for your own stuff, cannot develop a way to not use a punch timer like a physical people people group. And you punch in and now you’re clocked back in and clocked out. They still have to do that at the Morehouse’s. So what ends up happening is your 30 minute break or your 30 minute lunch or whatever it is, ends up being like a five minute break because you then have to stand in line to punch back in with hordes of people who also took a break at that exact same time. Just like unless you want to show up late, even though you’re not late, you’re in the warehouse, you have to go through this like super antiquated, like punching system where like it’s just it’s stupid.

[00:55:55] And these are things that obviously are coming to light now more than ever because of the because of all the stuff coming out, because Amazon News started spouting its weird, antagonistic stuff just like it every day. It’s like it’s tweeting about how like unions are bad, how like if you believe this, you’re dumb. This is really what’s happening. We’re the best. Amazon’s number one. Yeah, I don’t know, man. And like I think this I think the Amazon stuff hits. It hits home. It should hit home here, especially to Riverside, because Amazon is Sabbatino is basically becoming an Inland Empire as a whole, are basically becoming like a city center primarily is where all the warehouses are. Amazon, I think it’s like four warehouses in San Bernardino City alone there. I think there’s two here in Riverside. And I think there’s one Tomato Valley. There’s there everywhere here in the area.

[00:56:47] So people that we know are people that interact with people that we know are are being disparaged in this way. And obviously there’s people that don’t care because like, oh, you know, they gave me stocks and I have look at all this money I have. And I guess like some people, like some people will look at the money in the excuse, whatever it is, for whatever reason. And I get it, some people are like that.

[00:57:08] But like I think I think that a victory in Atlanta is going to mean a victory for the Inland Empire. So it’s like I support that stuff.

[00:57:18] A thousand million percent like I know one like Bernie Sanders was raising and like he was raising funds for them in the early days. I get the money. I was like, absolutely, man, like. Here you go, like take the money, give it to them, have them one for that union push because you can hit the nail on the head.

[00:57:35] When you said that this theoretically could be one of the most pivotal points for US labor relations since Reagan’s fucking Google ass killed the unions, you know, with the airline unions back and back in the 80s. So it’s like the fact that unions can come back, the fact that, you know, unions died in the 80s for the most part. Obviously, some unions are still around. And they’re coming back because people are realizing that 40 years without unions, like if you look at like the income disparity, if you look at the charts after the eighties, after the unions go away, that shit fucking executive pay goes up and employee base stays stagnant.

[00:58:17] Except inflation, that means you’re actually making less money. And I think the important thing here, right, is like. You don’t have to be a like this is what kind of bothers me.

[00:58:27] It’s like you don’t have to be political and say, like, I’m a Democrat or Republican, you should care about people. Like this is a people question. And we can talk if that’s a Republican like that’s you’re pissing in a bottle. Like, that’s it’s awful. Yeah.

[00:58:39] Like, I can go and explain, like, for example, and I’ll pull it in on a very capitalistic lens. Right here is look, what is happening is what I was explaining is something called cronyism, where it’s one company creates so much power for themselves, where they are the socialist entity that can control labor laws, they can control labor relations, they can call governmental policy. That’s very scary to me because that’s not creating a free market. Right, for somebody who is hardcore, like I’m a capitalist. Right. And like, I honestly would put myself in that bucket to that lens. But I also care about people. So there’s a lot of policies that I think should be changed because of that. If you want to create a free market, then make it so that you can actually have companies that compete against each other, multiple different opportunities for people to get hired. Right. That increases everybody’s income because now they have to get the top talent right back and forth instead of one company that can just cycle people through however they wish, you can actually create real competition and innovation out of that instead of one conglomerate, which then can become stagnant and then push back and never help the individuals kind of like grow. It’s not helping income growth. It’s helping the business grow their capital very, very quickly, which then goes to the executives, their stockholders of the company, not the people actually creating the income wealth. And I think that’s what I hear this all the time, which is like, well, they took the risk, so they get the reward. I agree with that because to an extent that if you come up with an idea, you should reap the benefits of it. But how much how much should you do it? Because if you create employer practices to get you to that standpoint, to make billions of dollars. Right. And you can’t even raise the income value you’re actually devaluing of actually innovating your make your business better. Don’t get me wrong, Amazon invest a lot of money into other technologies they’re creating and they’re using their cash flow for that thing. And that’s great. They are creating a lot of great innovation that makes the United States very competitive. Yeah, it’s fantastic. But that doesn’t mean that as a company, as a whole, you can then completely forget about one side of like where the actual hard core labor is happening and people have to pay their bills and all these things. And it’s great that they’re paying fifteen dollars an hour, which is, look, they’re paying more than most companies. And I respect that side. But you also have to treat it with how are the workers working to get that fifteen dollars an hour. Yeah, because it has to be measurable to a real labor standard. So it’s competitive in the market because it’s not like that. And I hear this all the way to it’s like, well they can always leave and find another company. No, they cannot. If bit if that company dominates the entire market, you have to leave the entire state like you have to leave that city. And it’s like that is if you don’t if you’re barely enough money to live in that city and you’re telling them you have to move, it’s not like they have money. Like you magically can just move out and then start their life all over again and stuff like that. So that’s where I really wish that we have more open conversations with, like on both sides of political ideologies, explained economic development, how it happens out of it. The whole argument that labor unions slow GDP growth has been falsified to the standard like it might slightly like little little ticker in my head because you’re going to have negotiations. But is that worth it to have at least the workers who are creating the income value to a business at the table to have these conversations to make sure it is fair? And I think that that’s where we need to go care about people.

[01:01:47] I think it’s not a question like that to me, honestly, like the most like mine. But like, look, I think it’s like I remember growing up, you would always hear this like mentality, just like, oh, yeah, you know, you’re a Democrat until you start making a bunch of money and then you’re a Republican and it’s like that. I fucking hope that’s not the case. Like but like you kind of touched on all the all the union is, is the workers have somebody who sits at the table and helps make decisions. That’s it. That’s realistically OK. That’s all you’re doing. The fact that companies are devaluing the people who make them money so much that they’re not even allowing one person to be a representative representative for the people who are making the money is crazy to me. I think that also kind of feeds into the nature of our business and how, like there’s like we’re about as transparent equals we can try to be, you know, but like, the idea to me is like the like if someone who was a part of our business, who was making us money, had an input that would help them do better and maybe even be more productive, why wouldn’t we take that into consideration? You know, so that’s a crazy part of me. It’s like is is this idea of like out of the workers? I know what they’re talking about. They just let them do their thing and let them run around.

[01:03:06] And they didn’t come up with the idea. They’re not sophisticated enough. They’re just doing the basic thing and everybody else can do.

[01:03:10] And that’s why it’s even though they literally can’t, they there literally is no robot around that can do exactly what the person right now. As of right now. Yeah. I’m sure that Boston dynamic is going to make an absolute killing. Oh, who owns a Hyundai? Hyundai has like a. One percent.

[01:03:23] All right, I’m not sure, but like, yeah, the thing that honestly does scare me and the reason why I’m I’m very pro union in this case is because.

[01:03:32] This is going back to my concept of like the concept of capitalism, right, like let’s let’s say that you are Amazon, which is making net billions of dollars that they can then put into R&D and not pay taxes on it. Right. There have been investing into these machines that they can put into the warehouses that displaces all the workers. What happens to that city and all the people that have been working there nonstop when you can automate every single thing that they do and you just put robots to be able to do it because that is the future. That is exactly what Hoover’s roadmap is. They want to have autonomous vehicles. So all these Uber drivers are going to lose. It lifts is going to lose the same way. Amazon, they don’t need employees. What happens to the entire economy based off that like that should scare more people because if if people aren’t making money, they can’t put that money back into the economy. That’s how GDP is run. It is run by me making a paycheck and me not putting in my bank account, but spending it. And trust me, Americans are really good at that. We’re really good at spending money. That scares me, because what what happens is if you create this massive income disparity gap and people don’t have money to spend aside from their bare essentials, like a bare, bare essentials, the the markets don’t move fast enough when new innovation comes up. People can’t afford to buy it. It’s splitting it. And what happens then is the middle class is paying on both fronts. They’re getting mad at like, oh, I’m paying the taxes for the people that are in lower class. No, you’re actually paying the the subsidies that these other companies are getting, which is now on the other end of it. And it’s just it’s if you look at cultural revolutions and all these things, that’s what honestly scares me right now. What’s going on is that we’ve gotten to the point where people are saying things like like a hardcore like let’s go to socialism. And then there’s like, no that let’s go to libertarianism, like do we haven’t even had real capitalism in the United States since the 80s. We really haven’t, because it’s gone to cronyism. And I’m worried about how mentality of the next generation, like we’re growing up into this really tense world right now where, like, people aren’t even like they don’t understand why capitalism works well, if it’s done correctly. But right now it’s not fair. And then they all start to understand why something should be free, like health care or education, because that also creates GDP growth. It’s going to be very interesting next couple of decades.

[01:05:44] I just I just think that, like, the new generation is going to even be way more of, like, socialistic minded. And I think it’s going to have a quick pushback, because I do think we in that case, we will be, quote unquote, the Republicans at that point, because I will push back on somebody who says that everything should be free because or like that you should have Zachs because then it doesn’t create an incentive in a market to create innovation and push forward. And innovation is really what creates GDP growth. So it’s a very complicated thing. And I think we’ve gone to the point where people try to make it so simple, like, oh, this happens and this is this is how it is. This happens of this sort is this should all be, you know, like work her ass off, you know, be successful one day and like, you know, do 80 hour weeks and all these kinds of things, like not everybody should be doing that man. Like if you’re providing value to society, you should be able to pay your bills. Simple as that. So, yeah, I’m very curious of where things are going to go.

[01:06:37] There’s a there’s a book, you know, and I said it’s written, you know, so, you know, his brother started a YouTube channel, things like Van Nuys does his name and he it’s fantastic. It’s a really cool that’s like super garde, like it’s like out of fucking left field, the stuff that he talks about. But he doesn’t really look away. But he brought this book. I’m forgetting the name of it, but it’s not like my, like, order list. It’s like to get it because it seems interesting. But this like idea of like every A-T, I think it’s eight years, every eighty years, there’s like a turning point with like society and every four there’s like four turning points in like a big like, like change I think is what it was, was that it’s like the big thing to remember.

[01:07:26] Exactly. I was really like last week. So and apparently like the big turning point for for us happens in seven years, like twenty, twenty eight I guess is going to be like the big turning point and the book kind of kind of references how like you know there’s like it’s all cyclical and how it’s like stuff like goes from like really good, like really shitty right now one of the really shitty one like like really like the very bad one. And then it goes like very shitty, like depressingly shitty and then it gets decent and then it gets pretty good and then it gets shitty again. Like that’s kind of the move. It’s like block one is awful, block two is better, like recovery block three is like state like you kind of stay in this like stationary kind of growth and then block four is downturn and then again it starts over again. Block one is really bad and it’s is like it’s just ebb and flow of ups and downs. So I agree with you after I want to read the books, I want to see I want to get my own kind of opinion on it. Yeah. But I think is interesting. This like because everything is cyclical. I think growth is cyclical. I just I mean, to some extent, like bad stuff is also cyclical, like big wars, cyclical growth, GDP growth, cyclical, like all these things are kind of happened in a cycle.

[01:08:40] But I think I mean, I would hope that. In the future, we’re going to realize that people are should be the thing that we focus on, you know, and I think that’s the thing that’s happening with it. The unionization and Amson is people should be the thing that we are focusing on because without the people. There is no money without the people. There is no business that can run, and if there’s no business being run, there are no jobs that are being created. There’s no jobs being created. There’s no money going into into the the government. There’s no money. Government goes down like it’s this very it’s this big circle of of of stakeholders that go back to it’s like GDP. But like the central cog is the person who makes the money for the business to pay out the people, pay taxes, and then goes back to the into the economy in some way, shape or form through a paycheck. Obviously, every piece is important there. But if you were to tell me which was the most important of the business or the person, I’m going to say the person, because the business is making money, unless it’s like a one or two people that made a software and then just like cut it out, just wipe their hands and they’re done.

[01:09:48] And I think that’s actually an important point is like when the people are no longer important in that, that equation is when we should actually have a conversation about universal basic income, where I think that things are going to go anyways because we are getting so efficient with technology that every one, every person like every year, like the output per person is increasing, meaning that you need less people in a job to create the same amount of money. That’s a bit scary because I think we’re going to go through this entire evolution where technology moves so fast and we’re creating so much value that people aren’t as important for a company anymore. Aside from those who create the companies. So there’s going to like like you said, I do think in history does repeat itself. There’s going to be a lot of interesting things that will happen in the next decade. It’s a it’s a bit scary, but at the same time, you shouldn’t be scared. You just look at trends and the best investors in the world, for example, they look at history. That’s that’s the pivotal moment of who they invest into, how they grow their income in all these kinds of things. And then the other thing I just bring up from there, just tying in everything together about what you’re talking about on on clubhouse for like everybody doing like forex trading and all these kinds of Bitcoin trading, all these guys just throw it out there. We have been going up in the markets for the last like, well, now it’s been 11 years. Oh, yeah. It’s it’s now we’re at twenty, twenty one.

[01:11:04] So it’s nine thousand, nine, ten, twelve years. Twelve years we’ve been going up, just putting it out there. It doesn’t just go up in my money machine does not always go. And that’s a big time fact.

[01:11:16] It will also go down. So just warning people out there because I think we’re in this weird effect of kind of what you brought up with the time slot of we’re in recovery mode now and covid like things are starting to open up. Things are new. A great I houses are going up like.

[01:11:31] So I’m housing prices are insane. Fucking hell do so. Me and Metellus are now are thinking like, OK, if she doesn’t go back for a PhD then we’re going to stay here and she’s going to keep teaching and we maybe will buy a house. The fucking values are going up like fifty grand a month of like any house like you see house going for like six hundred thousand dollars this month. Next month is going to go for like six hundred fifty thousand dollars. Like it’s like values are like climbing really, really fast right now because like economy’s opening back up, people getting jobs again. And for some reason the housing market things are perfect. Time to time to just start raking in money.

[01:12:05] Yeah, things are irrational right now. Very, very irrational. We went through this weird stimulus. People think it’s fine just putting it out there. It’s not going to be like that forever, and it just kind of ties into everything we just talked about here. Put all your money in Dogecoin. Absolutely not. Do not listen to that. And we are financial experts.

[01:12:27] And it’s just can I bring up real quick, quick, quick aside here. Can I just bring up the fact that if you had listened to me when I first brought up Dogecoin, I you would be you wouldn’t make so much money. You would make so much money. Then you might as well just open a clubhouse at this point and talk about crypto trading.

[01:12:41] Now, I might I’m going to make a I’m going to make a dogecoin, a bot that just sells it buys Doge. The minute Elon Musk tweets anything that has the word dodgin, it buys it for me automatically and then dumps it when I hit 20 percent. Because have you any time you tweets about it goes up like 30 percent.

[01:13:02] That’s ridiculous. But yeah, I mean, got to target all those points. And definitely if you’re interested in a blog in these kinds of things, listen to the previous podcast where there’s actual experts talking about the world of cryptocurrency. I thought I wasn’t a part of that conversation is really you were banned for.

[01:13:17] I was banned. I literally I want the audience to know that I literally was not allowed to be a part of that conversation because I would have been a bad boy. The blog is dumb.

[01:13:26] Yeah, I didn’t know about it. Damn it, Heidi. Via Broken, but turn it off for today.

[01:13:34] Social media is changing. Obviously, that’s one thing we brought up in the beginning. Keep watching what’s happening with Amazon. Like don’t just like wash it off. Like, this is an important piece of U.S. forces are going to go. So definitely watch what’s going on there. Well, we’ll probably talk a little bit more once we hear more about what’s kind of going on there and what that really means, because all these things impact you. You should be talking about these things with other people that actually might have other opinions from you. And I think that’s also very healthy. That’s also the main idea of this podcast is really talk with as many people as possible. And you don’t have to agree with everything. Ballis, hear them out, because if you’re in your bubble, it’s a little little little scary world out there, you know?

[01:14:10] I mean, that’s you go into the into the storm. The Kuhnen. Yeah. World. Yeah, yeah. I watched that documentary on HBO, Max. It’s fantastic.

[01:14:17] Yeah. That is definitely the tricky part for me. It’s like I feel like I’ve cultivated at least one like Twitter and stuff like that. I’ve cultivated this like beautiful bubble of just like I’ll just be like.

[01:14:27] Like what’s like a like something I would tweet, I don’t know, like Jeff Bezos or Google and then like people will be like, hell, yeah I do like like like to tweet. And it’s just like I want someone to, like, come at me with. Just like Jeff Bezos isn’t cool because of this reason, because then I can I can have a conversation with them about it. But like the only the only person that you can you can add in your tweets a reply to in a tweet and like people will go at you as Elon Musk. Have you like the musk heads? Like I if you if you are Musk tweets and under his tweet, you put your dumb just like you are and then dumb. So I guaranteed within five minutes you’ll get a reply just like that is just like the smartest man in the world. Exactly like he’s he’s he landed something on the moon. Like what did you do exactly. Like well who are you for some reason man. Elon Musk just just does has people at his back and will. I don’t know. I don’t know. It’s strange.

[01:15:26] You want to use a quote on you and you one. So I mean, I will applaud him for that. I think he does a lot of stuff that does piss me off.

[01:15:32] But aside from that, I want to point out I’m never buying a Tesla. I’m for sure why there’s so many options that I don’t so many options. It’ll be a Tesla, so many options. Now, I’ll make fun of you.

[01:15:44] My friends just got a Tesla and he’s he’s trying to get the andred of cars, although I hear.

[01:15:52] All right, I a circle goes full circle.

[01:15:58] No, I look right now, if I was in the market for a brand new car, I’d be pretty hard pressed to find an electric vehicle that was better than a Tesla like a Model three or Model S, but I think in like three years when I am looking for a new car, I think by then there’s going to be some pretty sweet competitors, whether it’s like Audi, Volkswagen, Saidee, Fords, garbage like Audi, Audi would be pretty, pretty nice.

[01:16:18] I’ll be OK with OK. Oh we’ll talk about three years from now. We can actually afford live.

[01:16:24] Yeah. It’s like you know you have Audi, Volkswagen, Ford which like is cool a Toyota. But like I don’t know, I, I’m, I’m slowly becoming this like version of myself that’s just like I only support small business and I want to buy American.

[01:16:41] It’s like I’m I am both I am both the proudest patriot and also like the most staunch critic of the United States at the exact same time. Like, I, I don’t have.

[01:16:52] That’s how you actually are a patriot. You should never take things as that is the best thing.

[01:16:56] I don’t I don’t use Amazon anymore. I don’t I’m that’s one of the proudest things that I can say. All my books are from small local indie places. I go out and I buy other knickknacks and Patty works from like smaller mom and pop shops. It’s more expensive and it’s fucking annoying than it is because I thought I have the app. So like I like like recently, I mean, my wife, like every six months we get like a big book, all right.

[01:17:18] And we just we read these books by asking a question in a second and we have these big book halls. And like we we we got like ten books the other day and we ended up selling more books in Riverside, by the way, shout out other books, go get books from there. They’re fantastic. They’re literally the mother and daughter and mother and son. Excuse me, run the damn thing. They have the employees. They’re fantastic. But we end up paying like total with all the books we got was like three hundred dollars to them. We were paying MSP. We ended up paying like three hundred and twenty bucks for for books.

[01:17:57] And like it hurts when you pay that much for books, you know, it’s like, oh all right, OK. It’s never a bad investment. But then I look it up on Amazon for the total amount we would and we’re only what it costs like one hundred twenty bucks on Amazon for all the same books we got. And it’s just like Amazon, it’s like what are you doing. Like how are you doing this. Like this is why are these small businesses are going under it. It’s like, like if I was just interested in the monetary side of it and not helping a small business, I would I would just Guaymas one percent. But it’s been like going from like Amazon, like for everything, books, every little thing to not using it, having avenues, Amazon. And like I think the beginning of this year I made it my my mission for this year to not use Amazon all the time I used it was for Nikil for his birthday because I didn’t want to like ship a book myself physically. So I bought him a book on Amazon and I shipped it directly to his house as a gift. But I can’t think of any other thing besides that. My saying I’m better than like everyone probably, but like it’s a book.

[01:18:55] But like, you know, it’s hard. It sucks. All right. The other question for me. Yeah. How many? How many. So you should be done with six books. How many Dr Seuss books have you read. Yeah, well, you really don’t want to know the anomaly.

[01:19:12] How many books you had. Twenty five so far. Seventeen. So, so out of those seven I covered six of mine so you know I read.

[01:19:21] OK, just, just give me this one just because I got busy. Seven seven. Books, do I have a.. I open every day. I did, but like I really like hundred pages a day typically.

[01:19:36] Jesus man. Yeah, I mean, whatever. I just I, I’ve been getting like 60 pages in a day, but that’s like me at the gym, I dedicate 30 minutes of my gym time to just like walking on a treadmill with like the highest incline and just like reading. And then and then when I go home before I go to bed, I’ll, I’ll, I’ll, I’ll read then to just read. I get some glasses, Spica some glasses if you need some glasses of like.

[01:20:10] Yeah. Now I can’t even look at these words. I’m just blazing through. Are you, are you, do you think of the book. Sometimes it depends on the.

[01:20:18] All right. So we’re we’re going to close out for today. Closing out. What do you think of the book? All right. We’ll close out on that for today before.

[01:20:29] But there’s plenty of sound bites in here that’s going to get us in plenty of trouble. So we’ll we’ll close out for today’s show before I die on that hill.

[01:20:36] Reagan is a fucking ghoul. If you like Ronald Reagan. You were you were also good. I will die on that hill.

[01:20:42] She’s been all right. Well, I’m happy to have anybody who loves Reagan on this show get them on here.

[01:20:48] But I’ll call the bulls to their face.

[01:20:51] This is an open environments. Have open conversations. No, I’m not. It’s welcoming, but I’ll be like, how about, say, nice? I’d be like, So you like Reagan. How does it feel to be a Jew?

[01:21:00] I’m going to say, OK, we’re going to close today.

[01:21:04] And I appreciate for anybody who tuned in and listen to our are closing our rambles. And the answer to how many books I’ve read is zero. But I’ve opened good PDF document. I thought you said you read the deep. Well, that was lost like last month. I hit three. So this must I haven’t I haven’t had any this month. That was last month. OK, you have three books. No. This entire year. Yeah. We should, I should have nine because it’s three months already. No you should. April’s two books were in April. It’s four by the end of this month you should have eight or two books. It’s two books a month. How many books using Pitofsky reading. No, I think I’m good. Oh, no, no, I’m not good. I think I’m not as far back as you think. I’m not bad. I’m not terrible actually. Catch up. Holy crap. If I were closing out. We’re closed after Today show. Appreciate you tuning in. Definitely.

[01:21:45] I mean, are we’re going to throw all the links into the description for almost everything else. We’ll have some good sound clips that will be posted out of this episode, but definitely tune in as we’re going to get other guests. So it’s not just me and Louise yelling at each other for an hour straight.

[01:21:58] Yeah, if if you if you legitimately do, I would love that. Actually, I would I, I would pay somebody twenty dollars. I pay someone a hundred dollars. If you’re like a legitimate Reaganite, I’ll pay you one hundred dollars to come on this podcast and tell me why Reagan is good.

[01:22:10] I’ll think of it in those naturally watching this right now.

[01:22:13] No, I’m going to, I’m going to clip this. I’m going to put an ad out to anybody and everybody. We are fading out by tuning in.

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